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How BallC made 2.3g in store sales last night

Aaron Barr RJ: Aaron CO: Aaron Post Rating: 0 + / - Total Posts: 81 Karma: 74 Joined: Apr 13, 2012	Posted on Jun 29, 2012 @Moe Jack sure nobody was "harmed" by this, but whats the point of continuing to play? I get that you don't care about winning, but its different with stuff like this going on. I can play chess against a clearly better player because its still fun to try out strategies and see what strategies I get beat by. If the other player waits until I turn my back and then adds pieces to his side of the board to win, he didn't "harm" me, but its not really fun anymore. I'm not screaming the sky is falling either, its not like I'm paying to play the game. Its a simple little game thats fun to waste some time on. I had more hopes for it when Scott was active in the forums though. Maybe hes still working on things, but who knows. Theres a lot of potential but clearly still a beta with plenty of bugs and exploits.
A J RJ: amanbearpig CO: aManBearPig Post Rating: 0 + / - Total Posts: 54 Karma: 18 Joined: Mar 30, 2012	Posted on Jun 29, 2012 @BallC: and we all saw exactly what happened when nothing was done about Walter's methods now didn't we? I heard these same arguments "he's not hurting anyone", "how does it affect you?" etc etc then as well. Of course, your actions are more akin to the goons and the resulting stock market implosion than Walter's. 2.3G of coconut sorbet?
Moe Jack RJ: Moejack CO: Moe Jack Post Rating: 0 + / - Total Posts: 128 Karma: 74 Joined: Apr 7, 2012	Posted on Jun 29, 2012 It is a good question, what is the point of playing? Most of us lost the game when we didn't realize that selling boats in the first 12 hours was the way to go. I think that the more money flowing through the system, particularly the B2B is the better. The more that you can make money by interacting with humans (and even their bots) the better. The demand equations and the prices are all so screwy, really I don't see how any of you can really stand it. It's so artificial to have these people who buy more boats than apples. Meanwhile, people are building huge shopping centers and there's not some mechanism to tie that to demand for iron ore and coal and steel. I still think that Scott is the person who you all should be grumpy with, and not because he hasn't jailed BallC, but because we have no fucking idea what is happening with this game and the most recent communication is that he's playing a zombie game...
Andrew Naples RJ: Clemen Salad CO: Clemen Post Rating: 1 + / - Total Posts: 214 Karma: 89 Joined: Apr 26, 2012	Posted on Jun 29, 2012 I think alot of these demand issues/exploits and B2b problems would be less dramatic with more people. (B2b wouldnt be an issue if the stores hadnt changed but thats old news)
Moe Jack RJ: Moejack CO: Moe Jack Post Rating: 1 + / - Total Posts: 128 Karma: 74 Joined: Apr 7, 2012	Posted on Jun 29, 2012 I will also admit, my argument is very self serving. I make my real money of a small handful of companies, I am somewhat bound to advocate for the person who's going to put the most money in my pocket. The game is really no fun when you have 5000m^2 of idle mines because you'd have to liquidate your B2B stock to get them running again.
Aaron Barr RJ: Aaron CO: Aaron Post Rating: 0 + / - Total Posts: 81 Karma: 74 Joined: Apr 13, 2012	Posted on Jun 29, 2012 Yeah with so few people playing its far more profitable to just run retail stores. My company Chemical Authority is way more profitable now that I put some gas stations down. Hell I don't even sell my own gas half the time, I just check out the demand statistics to decide what to import.
Bob Malone RJ: Bob Malone CO: Malone Post Rating: 0 + / - Total Posts: 341 Karma: 191 Joined: Apr 17, 2012	Posted on Jun 29, 2012 It is a good question, what is the point of playing? Most of us lost the game when we didn't realize that selling boats in the first 12 hours was the way to go. Unless your objectiv is to be ranked first, no, not really. Personnaly I don't care beeing 10th, 100th or 500th if everyone play fair. But seeing players doing exploits, creating billions of money from thin air, and crushing all markets is just indicate me that I have to take the door and say goodbye to this great game. If BallC is not jailed it would be the biggest mistake done by RJ so far, and a clear message to all fair players that they have to find a new game to play. You will never find any successful game where cheating is the rule. If this exploit is not fixed asap, I am afraid that we will see very soon many companies with billions. @Moe : you are right that this game need more player interactions, and I have tons of ideas about it, but I guess we need to be patient. By the way, you should sell intermediate products on B2B and not only raw material, try to sell some steel, some plastic etc which are used everywhere. There is no added value to produce iron or coal.
Moe Jack RJ: Moejack CO: Moe Jack Post Rating: 0 + / - Total Posts: 128 Karma: 74 Joined: Apr 7, 2012	Posted on Jun 29, 2012 bob Malone, When your company has a NW of 20 Million, then the 200Million company is just as "bad" as the 2G company when you have 200 Million. As for the intermediate materials, I decided this time around that i did not want to do vertical integration. I don't want to have to have two different types of research. Someday, if I can ever get enough money (sooner than later if BallC doesn't go to jail) then I'll be able to start a second company that uses the materials from the first.
Moe Jack RJ: Moejack CO: Moe Jack Post Rating: 0 + / - Total Posts: 128 Karma: 74 Joined: Apr 7, 2012	Posted on Jun 29, 2012 @Aaron, I was doing that at the start, when there was no one to buy any B2B, but I hate managing the goods. It was taking way too much attention. Then Rat and Joy jumped into my market and screwed up that line of revenue for me.
Bob Malone RJ: Bob Malone CO: Malone Post Rating: 2 + / - Total Posts: 341 Karma: 191 Joined: Apr 17, 2012	Posted on Jun 29, 2012 When I started on the beta server, my NW was 5M and there were already companies with dozens of billions, and I didn't care. These are players that had started before me, and that was fair that they had such advance. ( by the way, few weeks later, I had also billions so the game is not so badly designed ) My concern is not beeing way behind some companies, my concern is to play a game with others players, sharing the same set of rules.
Andrew Naples RJ: Clemen Salad CO: Clemen Post Rating: 1 + / - Total Posts: 214 Karma: 89 Joined: Apr 26, 2012	Posted on Jun 29, 2012 "My concern is not beeing way behind some companies, my concern is to play a game with others players, sharing the same set of rules." Yea basically this
Cian Kemp RJ: Cian Kemp CO: Cian Kemp Post Rating: 1 + / - Total Posts: 183 Karma: 58 Joined: Apr 9, 2012	Posted on Jun 29, 2012 @BallC: Assuming you aren't trolling here, but: You found an error in the game and exploited it for 2.5g of sales. That doesn't seem wrong to you? It's obviously not intended, it's an exploit due to a error in the game design. It's just as bad as the stock market shenanigans that went on in the old server. @Moejack: Selling aircraft (boats never did do very well from what I saw) has nothing to do with this. He made his early money on aircraft, but RJ adjusted it so that it's no longer so exploitative. My new aircraft company still makes far less money than my electronics or clothing companies. You didn't "lose the game" because you didn't do this. Most of it was bad tactics or starting late. I personally started as an electronics company, which is mid-range in terms of the item values involved. I then used that money to get into clothing, which has even lower item values. Only just recently have I gotten into aircraft, which so far has been an enormous cash sink with about the same profit as my clothing company. Nothing I've done could be seen in any way as exploiting the system or playing unfairly - I simply purchase materials off the b2b that you and others provide at the prices you provide them for, produce quality products, and sell them at a reasonable yet profitable price both on the b2b and in stores - and every penny I get I immediately spend on upgrades to keep my company growing (my electronics company currently has 7 stores, two of them are in full upgrade mode, I plan to set another to upgrade as the cash gets available). This tactic has given me nearly a billion in total net worth after all this time of playing. Others could do the same, no tricks or exploits necessary. Given enough time they could even surpass me - I doubt I'll ever start a fourth company (without bots it gets to be a pain to run too many), and eventually it gets obscenely expensive to expand the ones I have. What BallC did here was generate over 2x of my total net worth in a few minutes of cheating the system in a very specific way. He then used this funny money to rapidly expand and grow his companies, which negatively affects everyone that he shares markets with. Plus it cheapens the game and renders the whole concept of a high score chart meaningless if people can get away with cheating. Say you and your friends are playing monopoly. The game progresses a ways and you're doing pretty well. Then another player reaches over to the bank and just grabs all the money and says it's his and then grabs up a bunch of the land that nobody has landed on yet and then plops hotels down on all of them. Would you keep playing with him?
Moe Jack RJ: Moejack CO: Moe Jack Post Rating: -1 + / - Total Posts: 128 Karma: 74 Joined: Apr 7, 2012	Posted on Jun 29, 2012 @Cian the Monopoly analogy is not applicable as this is not a zero sum game. BallC got money from robo citizens, not you or me. Furthermore, those robots have unlimited pockets. It's not like the other markets suffered because a Coconut Sorbet craze caused everyone to liquidate their savings and stop buying more cars than apples. That's the real problem. At the time when people were able to sell a few million in planes, the effect was every bit as drastic and demoralizing as this. I was sitting there, plodding along, as I still am, and all of a sudden I am 50 million behind! I got over it and I suggest everyone else does it as well. The high score chart is already meaningless for the reasons stated above. The game has ingrained imbalances that are ridiculous. As for people jumping in markets, I mentioned before that Ratan himself joined the industrial market, just as I was getting traction, with a mysterious 50 million and some large stores. No one flipped out when that happened, well I did to him a little and he stayed in the market anyway. People probably should leave the game, bitching about incidents like these seems to just lead to knee jerk reactions and more exploits, which leads to more bitching about another subject. Remember when we were mad about bots?
Dan Laurence RJ: Sourpuss CO: Sourpuss Post Rating: 1 + / - Total Posts: 49 Karma: 15 Joined: Mar 27, 2012	Posted on Jun 29, 2012 I promise to buy more minerals from you Moe. Heck, I'm getting rid of my mine! FOR YOOUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU And Ratan got a $10m payout when he had the wipe-mistake. Evidently he wiped 'his' account as well. BallC was also one of the payout recipients; maybe 15 in total?
Moe Jack RJ: Moejack CO: Moe Jack Post Rating: 1 + / - Total Posts: 128 Karma: 74 Joined: Apr 7, 2012	Posted on Jun 29, 2012 @Sourpuss Hopefully I can keep up with the demand. Which brings me to one final point. Instabuild, in my opinion, is a bigger problem than almost any other. You want to talk about a major advantage, and one that makes NO SENSE, that's what it is. You're punishing people for doing things "the right way" and giving a massive advantage to people with big bucks. If BallC and everyone else had to build their shit at a slow rate over 500m^2 none of this would be an issue, none of it.

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